"When the first shots are fired," said the voice on the phone, "you heard it from me first."
"Shots?"
"You think the militia is going to allow our nation to be overrun?"
"I have faith in our police."
"Half of them are in the militia."
The phone call was disturbing.
It's pretty bad when Gov. Gary Herbert, hardly a liberal, is Utah's voice of reason in the immigration debate, but that's where we are. He and Attorney General Mark Shurtleff are discussing work permits, meeting with advocacy groups, hunting down options, debunking myths.
Good for them. Screamers have dominated this debate for too long.
I wrote a column last week about the list of 1,300 names some state workers put together. The list supposedly showed people who are not in Utah legally, although many were.
My column made three points: Americans have always discriminated against immigrants. It is impossible to "secure" our borders in any meaningful way. Most seriously, the people who put that list together violated state and federal confidentiality laws, threatening the foundation of good government.
Yes, I got a lot of mail.
Many positive comments were like the one from a former city clerk who said, "Government can't work without confidentiality."
A man up in Eden said the column sparked an evening's discussion with his kids.
The negative comments can be summarized in two words: "They're illegal!"
It was a broken record. No matter what I said, "They're illegal" was the response.
"These people have no business being in this country, PERIOD," screamed a typical note. "If they followed the proper procedure and entered our country legally, that would be fine. But THEY DON'T."
I said state employees violating confidentiality and convicting people without trial ought to scare him more than undocumented aliens. Didn't matter: "They're illegal!"
Gov. Herbert does get it.
People are frustrated, he said last week, but that's no excuse for the list. People frustrated with poverty can't go rob a 7-Eleven.
My friend on the phone, like many, is so frustrated he wants the border sealed tight as a drum, a new Iron Curtain.
"How many billions should we spend doing that?" I asked.
"Do we just let them come in?" he answered, then threw in the myth about Mexico wanting to take Utah and Arizona back.
That's why, he said, the militia may have to act.
In my column, I lumped Rep. Rob Bishop with these "build a wall" folks. I am happy to say I was wrong.
Rob called and was quite nuanced in correcting me. Not only does he agree that a 2,000-mile wall is impossible, but also he said garden-variety illegals are not the issue.
"If someone wants to come pick lettuce," he said, "I'm not too worried."
His concern is that the Border Patrol can't do its job because of regulations that protect wilderness areas. Drugs, prostitution and other criminal activities use those areas, he said.
"These are the baddest of people who are destroying our country," Rob said. "Until that first step takes place, there will never be an atmosphere where people can talk."
But we need to talk. I asked Rob, "What do you say when people demand a Berlin Wall along the border?"
"Try not to get into an argument," he said.
Wrong answer.
Rob should argue, even if it gets him called a traitor or, worse, a liberal.
Our leaders need to demand respectful debate. They need to discuss workable answers.
If they let the screamers ("They're illegal!") continue to dominate, that prediction about the militia could come true.
"Wasatch Rambler" is the opinion of Charles Trentelman. You can call him at 801-625-4232 or e-mail him at ctrentelman@standard.net. He also blogs at www.standard.net.
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